Bye Flash :(
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- doublespaced0
Seriously, Windows users still have to install the Flash Player manually. Get over it people, Apple is not killing Flash, blocking it or anything of the sort. They're just not pre-installing it or including it in their Software Update. Damn.
- <instrmntl
- how will all the mac users play Farmville?jhey
- download Flash, of course!doublespaced
- ernexbcn0
@instrmntl I thought we went through this before, Apple released their iPhone with no SDK whatsoever and told everyone to write web apps for it, the developers said fuck that noise and they quickly worked they way to release a proper SDK.
While all that happened, Adobe was sitting on their asses not realizing the potential and future of smartphones and mobile devices. They never committed with Apple to even release a decent Flash Player for OS X as a sign of good will. Then, they started working on a new Flash Mobile player that was more hyped than Duke Nukem Forever and took them about 4 years to actually deliver one for Android. In the meantime Apple released 3 phones and 1 tablet and developers not seemed to have any problems in learning Objective-C and release stuff for it.
I don't particularly care about these kind of benchmarks, but what's true is that Adobe didn't seem to care much about Apple business in general.
- not so much they didn't care.. they got fucked in the ass by Jobs several times.. espeically by killing AE by releasing final Cut pro..Boz
- cut pro.. but even after that.. they didn't want to give Adobe access to specific APIs in OSX that had direct access to hardwareBoz
- hardware and told them.. just use APIs we allow everyone.. unfortunately those APIs couldn't provide performance needed for Flash player to run like it does on PC.Boz
- needed for Flash player to run like it does on PC. I hate when people try to defend Apple as if they are saints and did nothing wrong and Adobe is lazy bunch of hacks..Boz
- wrong and Adobe is lazy bunch of hacks.. What a bunch of bullshit.Boz
- twokids0
if you want to build a device to fit in your pocket and expect it to do what a desktop or good laptop can do - well that is the kind of thinking that gets everyone confused.
just because it can connect to the web doesnt mean it is the same as what is on your desk
- ukit0
Let's face it...Flash ads KILL your bandwidth and load time. I think most people realize this.
I'm not saying it would necessarily be better if there were just as many ads done with HTML5, or that this is a verdict on Flash the technology, but it is what it is.
DEAL WITH IT
- Boz0
there are phones/tablets coming out in next 2 months that will have dual core ARM processors and they will be the same price as current crop. It's called progress.
In any case.. this will be irrelevant because Adobe is finally rewriting parts of Flash Player to be fully GPU accelerated and you can run heavy 3d stuff too..
The reason we didn't see this done sooner because we didn't really have the need for low performance, high battery devices and Flash running on them.. nothing about them was smart, browsers were awful etc..Adobe/Macromedia was improving player's performance for desktops but there wasn't that much rush because the desktop machines were growing in speed insanely with multiple cores etc. They still did improve it, but it wasn't done all GPU because there was really no need for it.. Nobody really cared about Apple and Steve Jobs' closed up platforms and the reason they didn't want to give access to certain APIs that could have made Flash Player work just as well as on PC.
Now.. in the last year and a half the huge demand has expanded and now there is need for GPu accelerated Flash runtime..and what do you know.. by next year, we will have it..
Flash Player 10.1 already now (even not GPU accelerated) runs fantastic.. It's so much better than Flash 10.
- twokids0
the future is about adaptive resolution. My company is probably going to purchase BrightCove as a service to serve video. The great thing that you give them one high quality file and they stream it in whatever way the device is calling for. So if someone has an iPhone, it knows this and serves it up appropriately. If someone has a desktop computer with windows, it streams that appropriately as well. That is the future. adaptive resolution for your media.
- ernexbcn0
Apple also decided not to include Flash in the OS X installation disk from now on because 1) you should get the latest version from Adobe's site, o 2) it's embedded on Chrome so if you use that browser you won't even need to do a separate download and 3) there was some uproar when Snow Leopard was released because the bundled Flash was known to have a vulnerability and by the time Apple pressed the DVDs and went through all their QA it was too late to include the patched version.
It's similar to what happened with Java and OS X, Apple decided that it wasn't worth the amount of engineers needed to maintain the Java version for the Mac and that Oracle should do it just as they do for the other platforms.
- ernexbcn0
@Boz the reason Flash player sucks on the Mac is not only related to those private APIs for GPU acceleration, the player has always been significantly faster on Windows long before it actually featured GPU acceleration (even on Windows).
- inteliboy0
"apple needs to get rid of flash because their iphones and ipads are complete shit, using 2000 hardware. its pretty simple."
Complain complain the nerds always fucking complaining.
My phone in 2000 had a black and white screen and 'Snake' to kill time. Oh and my PC would have choked trying to edit HD video, weighed 2+ kilos and was this ugly ass beige box that sat under my desk.
- Boz0
ernexbcn..the problem is that Flash player doesn't only play video, it does a ton of other things..it's a full blown platform.. it does a ton of other things that need access directly to hardware they just couldn't get from Apple. Apple always created APIs for developers to use but in some cases (such as Core Animation) they are just not fast enough for Flash.. GPU is just the most recent thing that was sucking the most CPU cycles that was recently solved when Apple opened up hardware to Adobe and a few months later Adobe showcases new beta version of player "Gala" with h.264 hardware acceleration.
- Boz0
As John Nack from Adobe said when Apple fanatics started foaming just like good little cult members:
"Yes, you're right: All good things must be attributed to Apple, while all bad ones must be attributed to Adobe. If/when Flash runs faster on Windows, that's proof of Adobe's incompetence and malice; if/when it runs faster on the Mac, that's proof of Apple's righteous majesty."
Always makes me chuckle because it's so true.
- that would make you an Adobe fanatic then, same shit isn't it?ernexbcn
- ukit0
A few myths I'd like to see ended in this debate:
-The idea that Apple "dropped" support or "refused" to support Flash on the iPad. The truth is that there was no workable Flash plugin available when the iPad shipped. Adobe then disingenuously wrote a blog post asking "Guess what's missing" after the iPad demo. Well no shit it was missing, Adobe hadn't developed the plugin yet. This doesn't excuse Apple's later non-support, but why misrepresent what actually happened?
-The constant paranoid obsession with Steve Jobs and him being behind any slight to Adobe, real or otherwise. Granted, he's been more vocal than anyone else about his dislike for Flash, but he definitely isn't "behind" HTML5 like some people keep suggesting.
If there's any one company that can be said to be behind HTML5, it would be Google (seeing as the author of the HTML5 spec is a Google employee, Ian Hickson). But HTML5 is really just the product of the WHATWG and W3C (the group that has overseen every version of HTML that's been released), and these groups include people from many companies, one of which is, ironically enough, Adobe.
-The idea that HTML5 will "fail." This just shows a fundamental misunderstanding of what HTML5 is. Would you say Windows 8 or the next version of OSX were marketing hype and will fail? HTML is the equivalent platform for the web.
In a few years, Dreamweaver, Visual Studio, Coda and other web dev tools will likely provide an HTML5 doctype by default, as will Wordpress and other web publishing platforms. The best you could do would be to argue that the aspects of HTML5 that compete directly with Flash won't be adopted on a large scale. But that's far from the same as saying HTML5 will fail or that it's a hype or the product of Jobs' imagination.
- Who's saying HTML5 will fail? The only ones who are saying something will fail is Apple fanboys talking about Flash.Boz
- "HTML5 is just a buzzword.. hype that Steve Jobs raised by trying to justify absence of Flash on his own devices because it would take control out of his hands."ukit
- because it would take control out of his hands." -Bozukit
- but, this thread is about the Flash plug-in on the Mac, not about the iPad or HTML5doublespaced
- I mean cmon...maybe you don't really believe, but could you be more misleading?:)ukit
- Boz0
@ukit
As I posted in the side note.. nobody said HTML5 will fail.. HTML5 is the next HTML. there's nothing to fail.. it's a standard.
The fact is. .HTML5 is overhyped.. and some facts have been greatly exaggerated to serve the purpose of one corporation and their tactics.. such as Apple..
HTML5 /JS applications are not faster than Flash.. in many tests and examples we have seen that's just not true.. The difference is even larger on Windows.
You can't do everything Flash does.. in fact, you can't do more then 20-30% of things Flash can do.. simple fact is that AS3 and Flash runtime offer so many things that are not even starting to get implemented in HTML5 or have been written in Javascript.. advanced audio and video controls, multiple bitrates, quite a few APIs that work with your hardware etc etc..
All it was said, which is wiser to do is to say that HTML5 offers some long awaited features that will make HTML/JS/CSS developers life easier and it will offer more flexibility in functionality and web application development and universal video and audio support.
It's a more realistic comment and still something to be considerably excited about. But when you go and start drumming to the Steve Jobs garbage that has no connection with reality and start defending and putting some absurd statements that Flash needs to die for HTML5 to live and how much HTML5 is better than Flash..then you can expect 90% of the web and gazillions of Flash developers to not take it likely. Especially because it's not true.
- Exactly: There's nothing to fail.. it's a standard. Couldn't have said it better.ukit
- ukit0
It wasn't completely aimed at you Boz, I think you have a pretty good understanding of these issues despite your bias IMO towards Adobe.
But I hear people all the time saying this stuff and it's kind of annoying that "web designers" don't understand that HTML has always been a released in versions that introduce new features and that just because the next release threatens Flash or does something else you personally don't like doesn't mean it's somehow all hype.
- you have to admit that HTML5 talk and Flash demise crap started after Steve Jobs wrote his shit letter. Let's be honest here.Boz
- But what was the letter in response to? Adobe is just as guilty in whipping the whole "controversy" upukit
- Since they flew into a temper tantrum after the iPad didn't have Flash, which like I explained is really more their fault than anything elseukit
- fault than Apple'sukit
- It seems you have forgotten how it happened.. Nobody made tantrum.. Adobe voiced themselves after he published the letter. The conversations they had were internal.. Jobs chose to take a dump publicly.Boz
- the letter. The conversations they had were internal.. Jobs chose to take a dump publicly.Boz
- No way man, the thing started just by the iPad not supporting Flash. Remember the blue legos? The post was in response to a few weeks of angst/ teeth-gnashing AFTER that.ukit
- response to a few weeks of anger coming from Adobe and Flash devs AFTER that.ukit
- Right.. he wrote that disengenous letter after Kevin Lynch posted this blog entry http://www.ilounge.c…Boz
- I suggest you read the letter and what he said.. Steve Jobs letter was just stupid.
http://blogs.adobe.c…Boz - http://blogs.adobe.c…Boz
- Miguex0
Thanks to whoever posted this info, after years of loving flash, I decided that indeed, is dead, by un installing it from my MacBook Air. I mean, 2 hours extra is 2 hours extra right? Time is money.
I also noticed that if you uninstall all the other adobe CS suite: After Effects, Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesingn & Dreamweaver, you won't be able to do work on it, which will also increase the amount of time that the computer can be on, unplugged, without being used.
- Just uninstall the entire OS, you'll get some awesome battery timeukit
- LMAO********
- NONEIS0
Flash does not kill your CPU - Shitty developers do.
Said it before, say it again - once FF, I.E. and safari can animate a damn thing past 15 frames a second, and only after, will Adobe need to truly "worry" about this sort of crap, the browser run-time is plain old shit for making things move like we are actually in 2010.