We need to update social contract theory.

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  • cherub

    "John Locke's social contract theory includes the idea that life, liberty, and property are given to us by nature and shouldn't be taken away. Locke's theory states that people form governments in order to protect these rights, but in order for that to work, people have to follow the laws the government makes."

    This project, to update the social contract, is long overdue. When these ideas were first conceived covid-19 did not exist. Neither did doxxing, GMOs, Facebook, surveillance states, global warming, or privacy/security breaches like cambridge analytica. But lately the most pressing problem is how to go about enforcing laws dealing with coronavirus.

    The problem is a problem of boundaries. What steps to take? How far should we go? And most importantly, if we submit does that take away our freedom?

    The way I understand the concept of "consent of the governed" is that by going along with the laws and norms of the society in which you live, you grant it legitimacy, you consent. If you didn't think your government was lawful and you don't consent, you would declare anarchy and rebel.

    Other non-mask related issues to consider.
    -Do companies have the right to spy on employees' personal life and fire them if they find something politically incorrect.
    -What do we do about rogue nations that decide global warming is not important and recklessly damage the environment?
    -Should data collection be illegal, legal, or partially legal? Who gets to decide what?

    Btw, this post was inspired by a Karen saying that she didn't have to wear a mask "because it was a mandate, not a law."

  • nb4


    • "Sir, this is a design forum."cherub
    • Nahnb
    • I'm looking at the menu right now and not one of the topics is design related.CyBrainX
  • Morning_star0

    Karen will eventually come around when her family and friends start dying. As obnoxious and reckless as her position obviously is, there will always be resistance to unwelcome change or a perceived injustice by some faction of the population. Life is not fair and nor should it be.

    Similarly to Karen's predicament, rogue nations will eventually fall in line as the cost of damaging the environment will become prohibitive.

    The data issue is a tricky one. We've all given away so much at this point it's difficult for this not to feel like trying to shut the door after the horse is bolted. In my opinion we should be encouraging environments where personal data is owned and controlled by the individual and can be commoditised by those who wish to sell it to the whore marketeers.

    As for your employer being able to fire you for being a nazi, it depends. If i'm stacking shelves in a warehouse for minimum wage and I get rock hard for Richard Spencer, i'm guessing the impact on a companies reputation is negligible. However, if i'm Director of Comms and responsible for the Corporate Social Responsibility and a 'face' of the company, and I like dressing up as a SS officer at the weekend with a group of likeminded individuals, it would probably be a legitimate concern to the company.

    In short, Locke's social contract stands and Karen should be able to do whatever the fuck she wants.

  • cherub0

    "...power ultimately can go back to individuals if the political society they've set up forfeits the purpose for which it was established... the people are sovereign...(under) sui juris" (latin for "self jurisdiction")

    Later in the broadcast Thomas Hobbes' concept of "state of nature" is described as one where "there is no law" and the only right people have is the innate right to self preservation. Three tendencies are identified:
    -the protection of property
    -the need for glory

    "there are cases where the government may not act for the good of the people... and it's at that point people have to decide are we going to tear up the rule book, are we going to get rid of this government and create a new government? ...because that inevitably involves violence and civil war."

  • cannonball19780

    Safety and fairness are illusions. There is no such thing as rights, only enforcement.

    • Enforcement is just as much and illusion. Currently, the US has a lot less safety, fairness and enforcement.CyBrainX
    • Enforcement is not an illusion when you are forced to conform.cannonball1978
  • cherub-1

    This thread is a perfect microcosm of why we will lose this planet. Literally no one gives a shit.

    It's like a bunch of flatmates living together, and dirty dishes stay piled up in the sink for days because everyone who sees them assumes the other flatmate is gonna do them, and in the end no one does them. That's our planet in a nutshell.

    • I agree. Indifference to the mankind's end is everywhere.CyBrainX
    • So one time I was at a house party, and there weren't no more clean glasses, so I starting washing all the glasses, ppl looking at me funny, idiotsgrafician
    • like "dude this is not your house, why are you washing the glasses" 'cuz I fucking need a drink morons...so yeah cherub, you're rightgrafician
    • Also I would add that any community is just a slice of the entire world...grafician
  • nb2


  • Bluejam1

    < insert George Carlin video of previous stand up performance in which he illuminates the golden nugget of truth that humans are fucking stupid and the audience just laughs >