branding. How much $ for a fondation
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- utopian0
On second thought, I would do it for 4k just to under-cut gramme.
- gramme0
@ d_rek
I think a minimum engagement is totally reasonable for freelancers. That's assuming you want to move into more strategic, systematic work, and away from the tactical/production work. It doesn't mean you'll have to say goodbye to typesetting per sé, it just means you'll ask for the big bucks required to create a proper design strategy in the beginning.
I recommend finding a niche and mining it deeply. Don't be afraid to specialize in one or two industries. For us, I realized that publishing and the arts is what I really enjoy the most. So those are the prospects I target directly, knowing that sometimes good work comes at you from out of left field.
- d_rek0
@gramme
I'm still working my way through that book you posted but I have a question - do you think it's realistic to have a minimum engagement policy as a freelancer? In the next year i'm going to aggressively target start-ups and small-businesses for freelance work and i'm just wondering if you think that business owners / entrepreneurs might find a minimum engagement policy tough to swallow? I really like the idea and will probably set a dollar amount–I'm thinking $5k is reasonable as a minimum annual engagement given the region i'm in.
- utopian0
5-7k
- gramme0
Wow. You guys could be charging so much more. $3.5k seems way too low for this project. Even as a freelancer with little overhead, you should be charging at least three times that price for a basic graphic ID package.
I've recently discovered a helpful tool to quickly discover if clients can afford us. It reduces time wastage on both sides of the table. I read about this in Blair Enns's excellent book, The Win Without Pitching Manifesto. Let's say you want to bring in at least $100,000 per year in revenue, but you don't want to work with a ton of clients. So you fence the table with a minimum annual engagement. Around 10% of your revenue target is a good start, but the number of clients you want to work with in a year is the most important thing to consider. So you tell prospects early and often that you have a minimum yearly engagement of $10,000. It might be $5,000 here or $2,000 there, but $10,000 per year is your entry-level requirement. That will scare off quite a few people, i.e. the clients you don't (or shouldn't) want. It will also open the door to better clients with better budgets.
You might make the occasional exception to your minimum engagement policy at the very end of negotiations, but the client should be aware know this. And you must be settled in your own mind as to why you're lowering the bar. E.g. the client represents a niche in which you've recently decided to specialize, and you would greatly benefit from the experience.
- sothere0
charge what you'd be happy with.
dont make it cheaper for a charity. they are the worse jobs ever, committee decisions and a sense of entitlement usually take the fun out pretty quickly.
- benfal990
thanks vaxorcist. good points there.
- vaxorcist0
Due to committee decisions at a foundation, I'd suggest presenting work differently....
Avoid what I call the "flying submarine syndrome"
i.e.
Imagine Concept 1 is an airplane
Imagine Concept 2 is a submarineNo, you can't have a flying submarine, or a submersible airplane...
Imagine client asking to combine the incompatible ideas, "why can't we just have a flying submarine" is essentially what they are saying, and you try not to get too flustered, then somebody says "can't we just put jet engines on the sub?!?... or.... water pumps on the plane?!?"
....and you try not to get too flustered...they are just doing what they often do when confronted with decisions, split the difference....
So... I'd either:
1. present only variations on a theme
or
2. present 2 different ideas and loudly announce that they are completely different approaches, and parts of one can't be combined with the other without compromising the idea.good luck! add double time for presenting and revisions at least....
- thing is, a flying sub is an airplane, and an underwater plane is a sub, and the client will still want to merge themmonospaced
- maybe you can tell them how expensive, slow, ugly and unreliable the flying sub would be...vaxorcist
- benfal990
thanks guys for all the advices.
thats why i like QBN®
Advices & Boobs, since 1999™
- ben_0
I Agree with Mono. The trick with npo, ngo's is to make sure someone has signing authority OR is able to rally their team for sign offs in an organized way. Non profits are much like large companies in that they have boards which often have to agree on everything. But in my experience, where they differ the most is in granting someone the authority to actually be responsible for the project in it's entirety. Good luck.
- monospaced0
Whatever you do, write a contract and cover your ass. Outline what they're expecting of you and quote for that. Then quote how much your time is worth after that, such as a revision cost. If they agree, then they are good people.
- vaxorcist0
the question is less the $$ than the number of revisions and how you find out who really makes the final decision.... working with a foundation may be different from working with a business....
- omg0
tell them you charge by the hour...
- benfal990
I think i will go with 3.500$
- newuser0
Why did they come to you?
- < dickmonospaced
- I didn't mean it that way. If they came through a connection, then a discount is appropriate. If not, who knows.newuser
- lolohhhhhsnap
- ohhhhhsnap0
^^ nice. i see what you did there... but yeah, is it a cause that you are a part of. i'd take that into consideration.
- d_rek0
If you really feel like you should discount your rates for them why don't you work out a percentage discount based on your current hourly rate?
And don't be fooled... just because it's a non-profit or not-for-profits doesn't mean they don't have the money to spend. All of those places play the NP/NFP card and cry they don't have any money. Lies.
Also, I would worry less about how much to charge and worry more about if working for this org aligns with your personal / professional values and code of ethics.
- thanks d_rek! Good advicesbenfal99
- this makes a lot of sense... plus, non-profit does not mean they aren't making and spending plenty of cashmonospaced
- What he said. Non-profits get dough...
XL_Smith