Getting older and working in design

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  • necromation1

    41 and still sticking my dick in the mashed potato... The key is to always make yourself relevant.

    Most designers just ride waves, i just make em.

  • CyBrainX0

    I haven't really suspected age getting in my way until a couple of years ago when I turned 50. I didn't have any issue in my 30s. I can get freelance frequently enough but I'm getting turned down for full time time jobs I know I'm more than qualified for even before I can talk about money.

    • This industry is f*cked.bort
    • I have a feeling other industries are more fucked in this regard. Our industry seems more merit based despite my problems.CyBrainX
  • Ben991


    i would like to buy a micro house somewhere close to nature and live a simple life with low expenses. I just need an internet connection, a good computer and some money to go on a trip once a year or every 2 years. I would totally grow my own food too.

    Dream dream.

    • Also my dreamjonnypompita
    • tesla powerwall duuudeArchitectofFate
    • georges has a plot of land...Gnash
    • off grid dream (but with internet lol).fadein11
    • I'll just build my own on my playstation10 in 10-15years and hang out in virtual space.uan
    • @fadein11 i've never talked about living off the gridBen99
    • This would get so boring after 2 days. Literally nothing to do.iCanHazQBN
    • plenty to do.and i dont talk about living in a mountain. I would live in a small or medium village close to civilisation. we have plenty of that here.Ben99
  • bort3

    Man it's nice to hear other people are also thinking about this stuff. This has been on my mind for a couple years now. I'm in my mid 30's now and work in digital design. Mainly marketing websites and little apps.

    I've reached a point where I don't think I can handle working in client service design anymore. The fear of ageism is definitely a huge motivator to get out of design altogether and the nature of client work has really worn me down after all these years.

    Moving to the product design side is a definite possibility but I can't help but think ageism would exist there too (perhaps to a lesser degree than advertising and design studios).

    I've very seriously been considering leaving design altogether in the next year or so and moving into a field like electrical engineering or healthcare. It's kind of scary giving up something you've worked years to build but sometimes you just gotta take your medicine and make the leap.

    • I wouldn't change careers unless you really wanted to. Ageism is probably more likely in groups that are more conservative than ours.CyBrainX
  • Ben990

    i think this is the most important thread i have ever read on QBN ever.

    • everBen99
    • exactly, first thread ever that didn't start or end as a jokeArchitectofFate
    • this is a really serious topicBen99
    • Many of us have been here since the start of "digital" and will be the first gen to retire in it. We should be writing a book or memoir!formed
    • ^ Im surprised there hasn't been more written about this in "creative" pressdee-dubs
    • ArchitectofFate - agree matenylon
  • ghandolf4

    "Never tie your self-worth, to your net worth". ~ Erik Wahl

    So far, reading your ages, I've got you all beat. Although I'm not a designer, or 'web-ist', I am a freelancer. I've done alright for myself over the years, but recently as others have remarked, things are suddenly not the same, and my work, (at least for me) has begun to seriously dry up. It's really difficult to chart a new path when you're older. I've had ups and downs, good years and bad ones in my line of work, but this is different now.

    Losing my job years ago, was actually the best thing that ever happened to me. It set a new template for me to grow and become someone and something I never thought possible.

    I've had a bought in the past with depression as well. That was a very dark and difficult time for me. I got past it, with help, just as you are doing. (Take care of yourself!) After all, this is just work. In the larger scheme of things, ...life, children, experiences, etc., this is manageable. These are bumps in the road, meant to define you, to bring out your best, to bubble up what's deep inside of who you are, and who you can be.

    Hang in there kids. I wish I could tell you it will get better, but in reality it only becomes different...and sometimes that can be better. I wish you only the best of luck in whatever it is that you do from here going forward.

    Also, this is the best thread I've ever seen here on QBN/Newstoday.

    Have a great day, Mates!

    • ("bought" = bout)ghandolf
    • thanks for sharing ghandolf!Ben99
    • I'm always looking for help from freelancers, let's connect so I can see your work and what you do.breadlegz
  • Horp4

    I'm 45. I started in graphic design for print at 15, and I gave it up around 2005 with a sideways segue into illustration. I saw the same thing happening to illustration as design so I lost interest and got out (1. It was overpopulated and therefore the value plummeted 2. It started to get invaded by a lot of computer complexity that I didn't wish to learn 3. It became very client driven as opposed to creative-leading).

    I dropped all creative pursuits entirely in 2009 and have never been back. I shifted into an area of consultancy and being seen as an 'expert' in an area that involves cultural insight, strategy, and material culture analysis. It was the best leap sideways I could make with the skills that I could repackage and transfer somewhere new.

    What I know is that I could never go back. I wouldn't earn what I earn from being in any of my previous roles (designer, creative director, art director, illustrator), I am definitely too old to learn the kinds of tricks it requires to survive now, and life is a lot less stressful once you step away from 'creative'.

    However, I couldn't say exactly that I'm happy. There's a whole lot of feel good self-identity stuff in defining yourself as somebody who makes their world work via creativity, and you simply do not get that when you step out of that mind-state and into an office/corporate environment where you are not judged, evaluated or appreciated for your creative production. In many ways I feel like Ray Liotta at the end of Goodfells.. a shclub, standing on his doorstep in his slippers, missing the energy and excitement of the old life... but I'm secure, I have a good income, my employers really value me, and life is generally a lot more stable and less fraught.

    I would never go back... I wouldn't want to even if I could, but I will always look back fondly on those times, which have now largely gone... or at least evolved into something radically different.

    • Spelling error: I meant Schlub, not S-Club7Horp
    • Interesting. Are you in a large city? Who are your clients?formed
    • I've often wondered about a similar transition.formed
    • S-Club7 probably have the same feelings.Fax_Benson
    • I'm in London. I work for a consultancy so we have a very broad range of clients. Some are very interesting and exciting, some are terrible.Horp
    • Interested in how you went about making the move sideways?dee-dubs
    • I've always believed that if you identify with your core skills rather than your vocation, you can go almost anywhere, even if it takes a couple of leaps.Horp
    • So you have a full time gig at a consulting company? I like your thinkingformed
    • I always thought you were THE horp lolfadein11
    • oops sorry my mistake - had a moment there.fadein11
    • Sounds like you're a little happier than before, at least Horp old fruit. You seemed to be carrying an ever present feeling of inadequacy and...set
    • ... the impending doom of being fired at any minute. Are you feeling like they value your shizzle?set
    • Also I really wanted to lay down an S club 7 joke but I have nothing.set
    • I think I'm a little more settled into this reality, and I've been doing it long enough that the private feeling of being an imposter has faded...Horp
    • ... I don't know for sure that I'm happier, but I'm less unsure now. As designers we combine personal passions with business. Divorce that, and you get two...Horp
    • distinct entities. I work, and it pays well, and it isn't awful, but I don't LOVE it. It doesn't define me or make me happy. So I now pursue other things that..Horp
    • bring happiness. I have an old racing car I work on and drive. It's what I love. As a designer, we tend to love 'designy stuff'.Horp
  • dee-dubs0

    Another interesting thing I'm noticing from a lot of these replies is many references to darks times and/or battling depression.

    I remember once reading somewhere (around the time Robin Williams committed suicide and there were many articles on mental issues) that "creative" types are much more susceptible to this kind of mental health issue due to introspective thinking and thought patterns associated with being creative.

    "Psychologists have been fascinated by the potential link for decades. The earliest and most rudimentary studies examined eminent people across fields including literature and the arts.
    These studies found that creatives had an unusually high number of mood disorders. Charles Dickens, Tennessee Williams, and Eugene O'Neill all appeared to suffer from clinical depression. So too did Ernest Hemingway, Leo Tolstoy and Virginia Woolf. Sylvia Plath famously took her own life by sticking her head in an oven while her two children slept."

    taken from :
    http://edition.cnn.com/2014/01/2…

    Apologies for kinda going off topic as it is not career related but also seems relevant. Seems we are have picked a tricky career path to maintain over long period of time and we are also likely to really be mentally affected by it too.

    • all creative fields suffer from this - look at music. self medicating, self destructive behaviour is rife...fadein11
    • no offense but this is v.old news.fadein11
    • still in topic with the discussionBen99
    • is it the career choice that preceeds this? or is it an internal malaise that leads someone to be creative?monNom
    • creative brains have a tendency to be v.introspective / reflective / over analytical - which leads to a propensity towards depression / self destructivefadein11
    • behaviour. Creative brains end up in creative fields (obviously).fadein11
    • consider diet, lifestyle, mostly.yurimon
  • jaylarson2

    Dylan Thomas, 1914 - 1953

    Do not go gentle into that good night,
    Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
    Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

    Though wise men at their end know dark is right,
    Because their words had forked no lightning they
    Do not go gentle into that good night.

    Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright
    Their frail deeds might have danced in a green bay,
    Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

    Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight,
    And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way,
    Do not go gentle into that good night.

    Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight
    Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be gay,
    Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

    And you, my father, there on the sad height,
    Curse, bless, me now with your fierce tears, I pray.
    Do not go gentle into that good night.
    Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

    • i've gotten into photography these days to supplement my income as an art director/designer—jaylarson
    • i make way more as an ad/d but the work can be slim these days. too bad, i'd like to be more of a design director than a CD, dunno if i'll get bored or morejaylarson
    • gigs as a photographer where i can jump ship and shoot full time.

      it's like watching the tides & knowing when to jump
      jaylarson
    • <THISnecromation
  • nocomply0

    I think about this frequently. I'm currently 32 and I run my own one-person business doing web design, development, and consulting.

    For now it's working out pretty well. I'm sure in 5 years it'll be more or less the same, or hopefully even better as I continue to grow my business, expertise, and get better at client selection.

    But how will things be in 10 years, 15 years, 20 years, or more? Will people want a 50 year old dude pitching them a website? What about a 60 or 70 year old consulting on their project?

    I have no idea, but I suspect that our culture of agism in this industry is going to change. It will have to. Everyone in our generation is going to have to work significantly longer than our parents and grandparents, regardless of the profession. That's just life. Age won't be what it used to be.

    Owning your own business is a way to avoid getting fired, but it doesn't solve any answers as far as gainful employment is concerned. I think all of us will just have to figure it out as we go along. That's what I'm trying to do.

    • Clients wont give a crap how old you are as long as you get them results.breadlegz
  • slappy0

    My plan to stay relevant is to slowly move out of design and into more of a producer role. Its fairly straight forward for me as I'm a digital designer.

    As the web is maturing, its becoming clear that good websites require good planning and great content. Therefore the designers role is moving from design and front end dev into a much more interesting place. Audience research, content planning, art direction, design, project management, online marketing and social strategy.

    I know this sounds really boring but what this translates to is time to do the job properly, getting to know your market by sending out surveys (social), interviewing stakeholders, and writing a kickass creative brief/functional spec.

    Then planning and finding talent, producing photoshoots, briefing the copywriters, planning and art directing videos, working with 3D visualisation artists, meeting with SEO and online marketing partners, finding/quoting with developers, forging relationships with other creatives.

    This type of role requires experience and is suited to older designers who know the business. Rather than being one piece of the puzzle, design the puzzle and choose the pieces.

    • We frequently win website jobs as most studios only do design and dev and thats all they drop on the table, a quote for the design and development.slappy
    • This is a legit path to longevity. A stressful one in my experience but legit nonetheless.bort
  • georgesIII1

    Great thread,

    one of my biggest fear is not to get older or work forever in this field, but to get bypassed by the technology we need to actually make a living from it.

    I've been getting more involved in the tech side of design and what is happening right now is pretty close to the invention of the printing press,

    Every month my inbox get flooded by faster, smaller, less complex to use IOT platformS, 3D printers, 3D Scanners, sensors, microchip,

    Anyone can come with an concept and actually bring it to production in less than a year which is excellent which is excellent, but when you take look in field like web development, anyone can now make a professional looking website with squarespace, wordpress, etc and it won't be long before an algorithm creates website depending on our personal tastes >> https://thegrid.io/

    So yeah, I would love to grow old in this field, but I don't think it will sustain me in the 10 or 20 years, The speed in which A.I. and other tech are evolving, is making me thing that "designers" in the future will be a select niche with a special set of skill sets,

    • "but to get bypassed by the technology we need to actually make a living from it." thisbklyndroobeki
    • the print world is pretty static right? does it ever change?bklyndroobeki
  • cannonball19782

    I'm 36. For me much of the burnout stems largely from doing what I do for other people and allowing their drawbacks to chafe with me.

    I love designing things. I hate doing it for other people. I think my escape will be the rough and tumble world of design entrepreneurialism.

  • trooperbill0

    i ran my own digital business for 7 years right out of uni and finally dropped it (gost) 8 years ago to work in house and at agencies. i threw the towel in with regards to design and moved to SEO tho it seems that im the unofficial CD at my current workplace and basically live in illustrator and photoshop 50% of the time.

    i manage a small team directly and have basically spent the last 8 years at a standstil work-wise tho the money has increased as ive moved job

    turned 39 last month and am having the same mid life crisis as many people here... is this what i still want to be doing, if not wtf could i be doing as i love the work so much.

    transitioning to a management position seems to be working better here as theyre investing in helping this happen and the people in the wider business (parent company) come from some high profile positions which i hope to help.

    in short moneys good, works ok, personal life is good but i feel unfulfilled and am worried for the future.

    im just not good at anything else !!

    ...seems to be a running theme of all of the people on here as we're all +/- 10 years of each other as befits people who discovered newstoday early in their creative careers.

  • bklyndroobeki0

    The more and more I speak w/ young folks about how their jobs, I find that they are finding work based on who they know. Also they are straight out of Design & Tech programs @ Pratt, SVA, Parsons.

  • Nutter0

    Many years ago, when I was still studying, I was out in the city with some friends. We came across a homeless man and fell into a talk with him. A friend asked him what he used to do, his answer: "he use to be a graphic designer".

    As my friends were leaving I gave him what cash I happened to have, hoping that some day that little bit of karma would prevent me from end up in the same situation...

    • At the height of my profitability as a commercial illustrator, I got chatting to a neighbour and we asked each other what we did. I told him I was...Horp
    • a commercial illustrator and he said 'ah yes, I know lots of those'. He then went on to say he knew a lot of once very succesful illos who were all now ...Horp
    • on the breadline. He said that none of them saw changes coming and found themselves utterly redundant as technology and younger people's styles pushed them out.Horp
    • Most of them were depressed, unemployed, big drinkers, he said. I realised that very day I would not be doing illo for the rest of my life as I had assumed.Horp
    • and sure enough I started to see my once advanced photoshop working looking distinctly creaky against newer ideas and styles from kids who were 60% cheaper.Horp
    • :(Ben99
    • Oh man.versus
  • breadlegz0

    Nearly 40, been freelancing (and running a small web company) for about 18years. Complete rollercoaster, but I manage to support my wife and two (soon to be three) kids.

    Although I do less design now and more strategy work. Then hire other freelancers to get the work done.

  • yuekit0

    Interesting thread. Just playing devil's advocate,

    Are burnout, money issues and ageism NOT issues that people encounter in other careers? I think it's quite common that people dream of doing something else, while underestimating the downside and challenges they would encounter. What is a "good" career for middle aged/elderly workers?

    One main advantage I can see with design/dev is that it gets you a set of skills that you can use to pursue other online business. Also the location independent aspect, not being tied down to a 9 to 5 office job could work quite well with middle age/semi-retired lifestyle.

    • Burnout is certainly common in most professions but ageism isn't universal. Healthcare, law, engineering are all fields where experience are seen as assets...bort
    • rather than liabilities.bort
  • mantrakid3

    Very cool thread. These thoughts are exactly what was scaring me a year and a bit ago (Im 34) when I was focused almost 100% on doing client service -based web development. Wordpress setups, theme customizations, troubleshooting, then the relationship would degenerate into getting their email going on their iphone and helping them figure out malware bullshit. I hated the progression that almost every client seemed to end up at. I was their IT department, by way of being friendly and good with computers, and the money was decent enough and paying my bills, etc. It was hard to say no and I lacked courage for many years to even consider it. I laid awake at night wondering how i can possibly still be doing that same bullshit every day for the next... 10... 20... 30.... 40 years..!?

    Then I panicked, i said fuck it & i screwed it all up by blowing through savings and making a dumb little video game & shit got real for me for the first time in my professional life. Now ive essentially entered an industry where age can be respected if it comes with mad experience, and theres sooo much shit to learn that i am genuinely interested in and i dont even give a fuck how old i get anymore because every day i feel like a fresh, optimistic kid at the best school in the world. As long as I have that enthusiasm, I have no worries about the quality of work i do or my perceived value... I know i got this from here on out. :D

    until i get tired and jaded and switch careers to porn.

    • great post can totally relate_niko
    • So you're in the video game industry now?Ben99
    • is it your game that's on steam right now?Gnash
    • What are you doing now?bort
    • sorry i missed the comments on this. Yeah Im doing game design for a new company now. Great job, flexible and creative, uses all my skills.mantrakid
  • mekk0

    I'm 25, started doing web stuff around the age of 14. Did a design school that I paid myself doing shit for events and bars. I thought this would be three hard years. haha. I dumb fuck. The real pain and struggle came when I started working in advertising. Suddenly my work was rated and it was shit. I needed another 3-4 years to really 'get good' and haven't earned enough to save a penny.

    Things are good now but your stories really creep the fuck out of me.