capitalism
- Started 16 years ago
- Last post a day ago
- 1,415 Responses
- Krassy0
"of the world’s 2,754 billionaires, 680 (25 percent) are in the U.S. and 338 (12 percent) are in China..."
"...a new billionaire is minted in China every two days"
Why Communist China Is Home to So Many Billionaires:
http://fortune.com/2018/11/29/co…- One thing bugs me is chinas banking. Are they more leveraged than the US to debt or what. Or is it purely relative to world position as us is with reserve cur********
- our ally japan and softbank running with negative interest rates buying up shit like wework. Was powells plan of normalization BS when no one else plays the gam********
- Is it assets exhaustion vs foreign fake capital buying your assets. one thing is for sure current monetary policy is facing a apex of sorts********
- One thing bugs me is chinas banking. Are they more leveraged than the US to debt or what. Or is it purely relative to world position as us is with reserve cur
- colin_s0
https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea…
Is America’s future capitalist or socialist?
Steve Pearlstein, author of Can American Capitalism Be Saved? and Bhaskar Sunkara, editor of the socialist journal Jacobin, debate.
- According to Hayoth..we are a right slanted, sometime left to center fascist society that often confuses socialism with communism and masquerades as capitalism.utopian
- Why one or the other? It seems to me that the most effective governments are those that are principled and progressive yet have strong opposition. The...Morning_star
- ...tension/competiti... between the ideologies is what keeps both sides in check and striving for a common good.Morning_star
- America has a future?PhanLo
- lolMrT
- i think socialism is the slow decay to any free society. death happens with all. think better to try and fight it as long as possible vs roll over and accept********
- death. isnt that what life is about. and jacobin while nicely designed has some of the worst writers. opinion and no backing. headlines with 2 page articles********
- that make no supporting arguments for the positions. again not too surprising since the material usually attracts the types that rather leave logic at the door********
- But i do like Morning_Star definition of the best gov as a gridlocked system that gets nothing done. I agree with that. Be scared of any "achievement" touted********
- yuekit1
- What are you claiming this indicates?Morning_star
- people are only living to 775 years old, compared to ~1400 in the 1950s.mantrakid
- ********1
Ken Griffin. How much is enough, dude?
- went to Havard and invested his money wisely. Don't blame him for your lack of self-determinationhotroddy
- ^ Exactly. Still 1% shouldnt equal more than 50%. Thats what I'm getting at. Tho it doesnt bother me the least, thank you very much.********
- What hotroddy said. You're just jealous. Wealth is relative; you appear greedy to others less fortunate than you.chukkaphob
- That's a lazy argument - 'if I question someone's wealth that must mean I am jealous'. Fucking lazy, but expected.formed
- Lazy but more than likely accurate. Does one want their wealth for themselves or ideals? If no display motive, because it seems very self interested********
- correct. it is a lazy argument which is what makes socialism so dangerous. jealousy is an easy emotion to politicize.hotroddy
- yuekit3
Opioid maker used rap video to push powerful painkiller
Employees at a drug company accused of bribing doctors rapped and danced around a person dressed as a bottle of the highly addictive fentanyl spray in a video meant to motivate sales reps to push the drug.
- and?PonyBoy
- Sales reps are going to push the fucking drug regardless of some stupid internal motivational promo (It's their job)... I'll ask again... and?PonyBoy
- You're right...nothing to see here.
Just a totally normal healthy society ;)yuekit - Companies do this internal motivational (whatever you want to call it) all the time to stir up their employees... doesn't have much to do w/bribing etc.PonyBoy
- "They’re charged with scheming to pay doctors bribes and kickbacks in exchange for prescriptions of the opioid meant for cancer patients with severe pain."...PonyBoy
- ... that's your story... not some stupid internal rap motivational stuff... I really don't understand why they'd report on that aspect... very weird.PonyBoy
- Did you know that more Americans are now dying from overdoses (mostly opiods) each year than died in the entire Vietnam war? Amazing...yuekit
- What does that have to do w/using a 'rap' to motivate a sales team? Again... the story is 'scheming to pay doctors bribes and kickbacks'...PonyBoy
- ... every 'large' company does these silly internal sales rallies... I still am lost as to why that's a story.PonyBoy
- Maybe you wouldn't expect a shitty rap promo video for a serious drug that is easy to overdose and die from...?yuekit
- To motivate an internal sales team? I've been dragged to titty bars w/cocaine, heroin and every other fuck vice you can toss at some 20-something...PonyBoy
- ... money-grubbing sales staff (male and female). It's actually shit like that that made me go back to school for graphic crap in my mid 20's. :)PonyBoy
- Again... this is 'business as usual' to motivate any sales team, dude. The story should be focused on the bribes and kickbacks... not what...PonyBoy
- ... is used to to motivate the fucking sales team. The AP blew it here. There is no shock if you've spent anytime in the 'real world' I guess.PonyBoy
- and here i thought i had issues... O,,oimbecile
- this is 'business as usual'
And you think it's normal and good for the business of health care to be run like a used car dealership? lolyuekit - I didn't say I thought it was 'good'... I even said I bailed on this world back in the day as I alluded to it being gross. But if you're 'shocked' by this...PonyBoy
- ... and by 'this' I mean Sales Motivational Techniques like some dumb rap... then you're easily shocked.PonyBoy
- A rap used in a corporation to motivate a sales team is definitely 'business as usual'... bribes and kickbacks are not. Focus on that.PonyBoy
- lol imbecilefuturefood
- would have gotten so much outrage and backlash in canada.pango
- the movie Office Space is pretty real to life (that's why it's funny) dorky shit from awkward forced birthday parties to shitty internal motivational rallies.PonyBoy
- getting upset over a corpo product (whatever it is) characterized in a tacky fashion and put to a rap is a bit silly.PonyBoy
- Go Patriots!utopian
- Did this tacky motivational rap cause bribes and kickbacks?PonyBoy
- kill it with fireMilan
- Questionable direction. Makes you wonder if this was their poor attempt trying to appeal to kids.pango
- it's a video meant to motivate sales reps, pango... hasn't a thing to do w/nor would ever be seen by kidsPonyBoy
- why you defending this so much?inteliboy
- why are they marketing it to sales rep like they market it kids? are their sales rep kids? is this why pharma industry is kind of fucked up because sales repspango
- are kids? really confused is all.pango
- Yeah this is a weird hill to die on. Maybe PonyBoy’s whole business is creating corporate motivational rap videosyuekit
- You make it sound like I approve of this. All I have said is how confusing it is that this is even a story given it has nothing to do with bribes and kickbacks.PonyBoy
- Anybody who has worked for a large corporation has had to sit through stupid internal sales bullshit like this... It is nothing new. It is almost always tacky.PonyBoy
- again... Is this stupid Internal sales rap the cause of a bunch of bribes and kickbacks?PonyBoy
- Take away this serious crimes of these bribes and kickbacks and you are left with a tacky internal sales presentation as your story... Which is a non-story.PonyBoy
- If you guys can’t tell the difference between an internal sales tool (a tacky one at that) and an actual advertisement then I don’t know why I am typing this :)PonyBoy
- Intelli... haven’t defended a thing. I’m pointing out that this article is going after the wrong story... That is all. Focus on the bribes and kickbacks...PonyBoy
- ... Not on some stupid internal sales presentation that never sees the light of day until the AP gets their hand on it to try and shock us.PonyBoy
- The sales reps sold to doctors and other Legal pharmaceutical distribution. This was never marketing for the public.PonyBoy
- You should be shocked that doctors excepted bribes and kickbacks... Not that some stupid rap video was used in an internal sales presentation.PonyBoy
- *accepted ( sorry, I am talking into my phone As typing with my thumbs gets tedious)PonyBoy
- Ya I'm only talking about the rap.
Does that shit actually work as a sales tool? LOLpango - pango... Think Steve Ballmer... "Developers! Developers! Developers!" That shit works for the right people. Corpo Sales teams are basically greedy men/women...PonyBoy
- ...right off the street. No experience whatsoever. They're easily influenced people usually w/only dollar signs in their eyes—yes, shit like that rap works. :-/PonyBoy
- No wonder the industry is wack...pango
- yeah fuck it, ponyboy you're a worthless piece of shit. go fuck yourself.imbecile
- I love you, imbby... <3
*pinches your cute lil chubby cheeks... SO CUTE!PonyBoy
- PhanLo1
- wow. first positive post in this entire thread. this is progress for qbn.hotroddy
- Innovation never sleeps. They'll be stand up hotels in the evening soon.PhanLo
- I wonder if they still stink of piss.Morning_star
- 100% they do Morning StarPhanLo
- Boxes?********
- shapesalad2
- Brexit and Theranos seem like similar things...shapesalad
- Wow. She's a proper psycho.MrT
- fila brazillia in the background.dorf
- She and musk will make babies on mars.********
- uan3
was browsing youtube and found this 4+ year old documentary about boeing, troubling to see capitalist greed destroy this proud brand and symbol.
the results of the ethiopian airlines crash investigation are still to come. no wonder they decided to send the black boxes to europe instead of the us for investigation.
- utopian3
Boeing got a record tax break from Washington state and cut jobs anyway.
A few years ago, Washington state awarded the Boeing Co. the largest corporate tax break any state had given any corporation — a massive $8.7-billion handout aimed at encouraging the aerospace industry generally, and Boeing specifically, "to maintain and grow its workforce within the state."
Unwisely, state legislators and Democratic Gov. Jay Inslee didn't make that a hard and fast requirement of the handout. So they've had to stand by powerlessly as the company has cut 12,655 jobs, or more than 15% of its Washington workforce, since that heady signing ceremony in November 2013. Layoff notices have gone out to 429 more employees in just the last few weeks.
- It's called Corporatism. Look it up!utopian
- It's not corporate greed, it's political incompetence.Morning_star
- Dems blew it here.PonyBoy
- who got the bonuses?renderedred
- It's not "dems", for fuck's sake, this is bought and paid for corporate power. It's everywhere.formed
- This is what corporations do - make more profits and cut expenses.formed
- political incompetence caused by corporate lobbying.uan
- lol—first off—I was being sarcastic. Second... if this was a Repubby run state you clowns would be all over the 'fucking republican' remarks and not...PonyBoy
- ... generalizing this as 'political incompetence' or 'paid for corpo power'. You'd be shitting on republicans along w/some #pubsgreed type accoutrements.PonyBoy
- This is proof that both sides are just as incompetent.PonyBoy
- Both are incompetent, one just happens to give handouts only to corporations and the wealthiest.formed
- Did those jobs go somewhere else? How do you just cut 12,000 jobs?********
- "retardation for the nayshun"fadein11
- little to do with capitalism and more politics********
- "[...] and that's what *we're* battling [...]"mekk
- ********-4
- utopian1
Johnson & Johnson knew about cancer-causing asbestos ingredients in its products.
- there was a class action lawsuit and they lost.pango
- they settled, actuallymonospaced
- that counts as a lost for me.pango
- totally understood, but to the courts, the company and lawyers, it's anything but :)monospaced
- and exxon knew about climate change 50 years agocolin_s
- we are lucky the tobacco industry only recently discovered their product causes cancer.uan
- and so lucky they invested some of the money they made in cancer clinics and treatments.uan
- utopian0
Elite Colleges Constantly Tell Low-Income Students That They Do Not Belong
Unwritten rules underlie all of elite-university life—and students who don’t come from a wealthy background have a hard time navigating them.
- i wonder about a poor family moving into a rich community. strapped on mortgage and no time or help to maintain yard, etc.. this would lower the prestigious********
- standing and brand. and un wanted. Is it a surprise that behavior isnt broadly applied. Plus those with plenty of income will hate to see others work harder********
- but that is the nature of pay to play vs hard work.********
- Id love to see all colleges lose state funding and go back to no gov backed loans. Would make the college compete on merit a little more********
- All the Ivy leagues want your parent's financials. I couldn't believe when I applied to Harvard and Columbia I had to supply those details.formed
- i wonder about a poor family moving into a rich community. strapped on mortgage and no time or help to maintain yard, etc.. this would lower the prestigious
- Gnash0
- https://gizmodo.com/…Gnash
- Unions are regressive nowGnash
- It's better the workers never leave the office.PhanLo
- I can't believe they're complaining that union workers are getting baseline fair deals now, and dares call them "above and beyond." Embarrassing.monospaced
- Unions support the self interests of themselves/members at the expense of non-union members. Using coercion to grow THEIR paying base.********
- What is a non union union member?monospaced
- Corporations support the self interests of themselves/sharehold... at the expense of employees and the public.i_monk
- Well imonk it depends at what expense you mean from employees and public. Expense of accepted wages or price among public?********
- You see the corporation (if not in bed with gov) needs to compete for employees/public monies. They have lot of competition based with ppl free to choose valu********
- unions are more of a monopoly regulating ppls ability to choose. What they do has much more adverse effects on gainful employment and public pricing********
- The devaluation of labour since the 60s/70s means that choice is illusory for a lot of unionized industries; nobody else is going to fight for fairer wages.i_monk
- Complaining about unions on those grounds is like saying equal pay for women removes their choice to be undercompensated.i_monk
- colin_s12
i'm pretty sure most people on this board remember "the good internet" - the newstoday days when everything online seemed wonderful - instead of the drag it is now. what happened? capitalism.
i was thinking about this while listening to the radio yesterday (yes i do this) and the DJ ended their on-air segment trying to sell something or other, and my brain just cringed. every single communication in America seems transactional at this point.
the internet, back in those early years, though shopping was an aspect of it, it was largely everything BUT capitalism. it was creative, free-for-all, experimental, engaging ... now it's been driven to the dirt by monetizing everything from clicks to forums to podcasts to user pages etc.
the internet sucks and that should be all the examples we need that capitalism has overstayed its welcome: in a single generation this marvelous opportunity for democracy and humanity in general has been turned into a shopping mall where humans themselves are as much a resource as anything else. and for what? memes?
- Even worse when you add in cellular data and geo targeting. Only going to get worse.
*shakes fist, IT AINT NATURALBonSeff - it's an evolution. at the start someone needed to invent how to make money with it, once proved it could be made, the investors pumped money in ituan
- then they protected their interests with corporatism. now society is seeing the negative effects and are testing different strategies to make it work better.uan
- it's in development still, has always been, next 10 years will show if we get better at using it and might even feel like the first humanist vibe it can has.uan
- USA does seem to be super selling all the time society.shapesalad
- I think the problem here may be more of a question of getting rid of the bad Internets and keeping the good Internets.sted
- that sentence has all the meme u need.sted
- agreed, but it is quite a cynical view. the internet is still amazing.inteliboy
- I'd also say the death of the internet we loved was because of narcissism.inteliboy
- I'm still recoiling from the idea that people take duckface selfies, post them to show the world how great they are, and call themselves 'influencers'inteliboy
- It's far more repulsive and destructive than websites and content creators figuring out how to make ad revenue.inteliboy
- Nostalgic nonsense.hotroddy
- @colin_s what should catalyze the evolution: war or consumption?sted
- i'm fine with consumption:access to content whatever it is, jokes, products, friends, qbn, access to work and sale on global scale isn't a bad thing.sted
- all of this made possible by generations of engineers and developers on a network what has underground, ground and near-earth level infrastructure.sted
- @inteliboy in the past decade how many people got connected and addicted in the same way when you first opened the internet we loved? :Dsted
- not sure capitalism is at fault in anyway. trading value for value vs what alternative? Being told and given only what you can have. Has the freedom of capitali********
- sm or that it provides been abused and let to rampant consumerism. Like blaming alcohol sales for alcoholism.********
- and i think advertising and media reinforce a cultural value system of where shit floats to the top and trends.... so much more than blame capitalism meme...********
- why cringe if someone is trying to sell you something? are people not allowed to earn a living? or should they wait on a government check instead?hotroddy
- as far as death to the internet goes. 1) iphone and movement to make mobile replacement for desktop. 2) business capitalizing on new niche and selling the idea********
- 3) ppl adopting mobile first platform 4) while this all happened social networks reinforced mobile and hooked users with dopamine filled thumbs ups********
- 5) everyone under the same platform and human laziness of following and being spoonfed what pleases them decreases exploration and desire to produce outside********
- the social networks, instead forcing to integrate and conform for the same dopamine rewards and values of said networks.********
- 6) soon develop a boring closed loop system of conformity and control, where everything is derivative and fake. where everyone is scared to develop outside mas********
- s appeal or standards and you get this watered down lowest common denominator stuff. that you can hardly be excited about or dislike. its just enough like********
- to be like ok like the marvel film formula, and by being the only thing creates its own inflated ok lets feel good about this feedback loop.********
- you see it in gold addys wordpress themes, like well something needs to win. Judges not knowing how to choose one from the next. Accept believing their own********
- authority in such things push it all forward and helps reinforce the systems********
- accessibility... its like forcing everyone to have a wheel chair ramp to everything. of course it will look like all the same shit. the more freedom you********
- can expect better stuff, more range and expression. hard for web to grow in a cage.********
- that´s to dramatic - it became commercial more useful, but also the creative outflow is magnified, when i think of tutorials -communities - communications.neverscared
- Just like this place, nothing better to talk to someone IRL********
- 6) soon develop a boring closed loop system of conformity and control
That's clearly QBN******** - it's all 'cause Jobs killed Flashformed
- All good things come to a trend.Bluejam
- Welcome to QBN AOC. Another brilliant argument you are making. Please stop unleashing your mind bendingHayoth
- Brilliance on us. It's hard to keep up with your top level genius skills.Hayoth
- @hayoth I blame fascicommusocialismfadein11
- @intelliboy influencers and that lot are all products of capitalism - doing anything to acquire power / profit from the consumer lifestylecolin_s
- still a huge amount of stuff in the old spirit, it's just slightly harder to find. This is a the natural progression of any media unfort.fadein11
- Let's go back to BBS!robotron3k
- w/out capitalism we wouldn't have nearly the advancement in technology we've had these last 100+ years—but yeah—shit all over it cuz your bored of the web :-/PonyBoy
- *you'rePonyBoy
- without the version of capitalism we now have, all that technological advancement would likely be much more technologically advanced.MrT
- Prove that MrT.PonyBoy
- Not sure I would agree that the internet as it exists today is 100% capitalism. Most of the big sites like Reddit or YouTube are free to use and and basedyuekit
- around either user-generated content or reposting commercial content without regard to copyright. Sure they try to monetize using ads but neither ofyuekit
- those sites are profitable yet. It's a weird mix of capitalism and free sharing/open source, maybe evolving towards something else in the future.yuekit
- its just free because you pay with all your data like what you see what you do on youtube or facebook... sites would not be profitable without it.api
- ukit of course internet isnt 100% capitalistic, but your examples paint 100% its trading value for value nature. you just might overlook values as monetary gain********
- the argument want for your view with internet is based on the infrastructure, ma bell, same as utilities. as far as companies go that operate on the web********
- that is more about rules and regulations of investments, and ability to acquire capital at losses in loose monetary policy or through passive investments of********
- of fools. You should read Huxleys Island. All value isnt about money, however its hard to develop a free society that trades in value outside something as money********
- money has liquidity. and all value needs liquidity in ability to trade value for value in dynamic range********
- Even worse when you add in cellular data and geo targeting. Only going to get worse.
- Hayoth-4
The narrow mindedness of colins arguments needs to be broken down.
#1 Complaint
Colin listens to a podcast and cringes when the guy tries to make a living.Life is transactional. If you guy to the store you BUY food. Does the DJ have a right to make a living? Yes. Do you have a choice to listen YES. If you don't support your DJ, move.
#2 Complaint
The internet int he early yes was everything BUT capitalism,Oh, so AOI gave away their products for free? Absolutely the internet was monetized in the early days, it was called the DOT COM boom. The concept was the same, people use my service and that adds value to my company.
#3 Compaint
The internet sucks because of CAPITALISMWhat are you talking about, rambling about democracy and humanity?
So you are looking for a society where the majority controls the minority? That's called totalitarianism.
Now the humanity buzzword is pulled into your deep thinking brain. I guess it's negative that 'humanity' of millions of people across the world meeting each other, and engaging each other is not positive? I have met people from Canada, the US, Mexico, and Europe through the internet. That is pretty cool in my book.
Or what about the 1000s of non-profits who get to share their cause across the world?
Or the millions of artists who get to share their work across the globe?
Or the musicians being discovered on youtube?
Internet shopping malls are a choice. I didn't go to any e-commerce stores today and guess what, not one site I visited asked me to buy something.
You are an idiot.
- What use is being discovered on YouTube when "Music, they said in effect, was free. But only the musical two per cent could afford to say that."
...Nairn - https://www.rootsmus…Nairn
- I actually don't disagree with most of your point - Colin_s' ire should be more aimed at 'eternal september' and absolute mass marketry..Nairn
- ..but you can't help but come across as a bluntly predictable apologist bellend for hard capitalism at any, usually social, cost.Nairn
- everything we have is thanks to capitalism, but a few qbners take it all for grantedhotroddy
- @hotroddy, who takes it for granted?fadein11
- those who like to shit on capitalism as a form of moral exculpationhotroddy
- Anyone here on the internet yammering-on in a man-forum about how capitalism irks them are taking this shit for granted... look in the mirror, guyz.PonyBoy
- Why can't opinion be met with opposing opinion rather than disrespect and name-calling?MrT
- Regardless of what capitalism has done to the internet, the internet has seriously fucked up conversation and debate.MrT
- it's not bw. Capitalism can be great, but left unchecked it bends to greed and the never ending need for more profits.formed
- Personally I don't take anything I have for granted, it's not about that is it?fadein11
- formed you qualify profits as a bad thing. you know its not that simple right? that ones man profits mean value for others. bezos profits your ability to shop********
- cheaply. profits are the ends of a system that works. as such in a system of no profits you could say no one benefits********
- a null a void, non existence and stagnation********
- so would u still damn profits and prefer stagnation or death ?********
- What use is being discovered on YouTube when "Music, they said in effect, was free. But only the musical two per cent could afford to say that."
- colin_s0
What I was referring to was a specific example about a broader idea - that transactional language and finance have become rampant in American conversation because of their essential nature to how our society is structured. Money is a dominant factor in any and every aspect of culture - to me that is because of the influence of capitalism.
The idea is that an economic backbone to society should not promote the complete domination of that society, nor should it emphasize competition at the expense of anything other than personal profit. The way this system leverages power is degrading to how our society tries to order itself. A great example is when a minor gun control law with 90% public approval failed to pass in the US government due to the capital influence of the NRA; our sense of economic priority and its creation of a political aristocracy has got to the point where children being slaughtered is weighed against a red line.
The internet was used as an example of creative free reign and human interest - a place of ambiguous social nature so not everyone on it was immediately thinking of how to make money, but rather exploring what was actually being developed. Human nature is to explore - and an economic system that uses transactions to facilitate that is not problematic, but one that says those transactions are worth more than what is on either side of them will eventually create the corrupt and decrepit social state currently being seen across the USA.
- tl/dr: business can still exist, and flourish, with a different social psychology toward economics that would be less about individualismcolin_s
- your assumptions to it all make no sense. 1) Money is a dominant source in societies as it is a way of trading value with high liquidity. Wont have much of a********
- society without it. Imagine buying rice with chickens if people only have chickens, its evolved the way it has for very easy to see reasons.********
- second opinion on gun point. 90% of approval for what? And blaming an organization. Can toss this whole paragraph out as garbage.********
- actually the whole dotcom internet thing was about a gold rush to find ways to make money. as far as economic system to it... u lost we... think your crackers********