Freelance Rate
- Started
- Last post
- 48 Responses
- gramme0
I don't really think it's anyone's business what your hourly rate is. Clients don't even need to know, unless the client is an agency that has already allotted at least a rough amount of time per project.
The mistake many designers make when calculating their hourly rates (I've made this mistake as well) is thinking of the salary they take home after all other expenses as profit. In fact, it's not profit; it's merely a business expense. The money you make above and beyond everything else is the actual profit.
The recent realization of this sobering fact is what caused me to recently raise my rates substantially.
- +1noneck
- Well said!Stian
- Did Jesus help you with this sobering realization? BTW, I'm TOTALLY kidding.monospaced
- recently recently, argh.gramme
- haha @ mono :)gramme
- +1 .. the rate should be a private matter.lukus_W
- so do you just quote per project and not an hourly basis ?traut
- Yeah I quote per project, based on an hourly rate I keep to myself.gramme
- springbok0
is there any guys from around manchester that want to divulge their rates? I will if you will
- your rates will depend on your experience :) Best advice is to get in touch with a recruitment agency and ask for their advice - which will of course be free :)gingerbreadlady
- gingerbreadlady0
I have no problem telling people my rates.
People pay what they are prepared to pay at the end of the day and it will show if you come recommended from someone that they will get what they pay for etc.
The thing is I don't think your rates should be set in stone!
I have a sliding scale of rates that varies depending on if it's a start up business, an established one, client budget etc etc.
I generally charge by the hour as otherwise it's easy for the client to think they are getting things "for free" :)- So the work is worth less when designed for a start-up than someone who's established?gramme
- i think it's more an issue of wanting the gigscarabin
- Yes, start ups will have a very limited budget and so I take that into account which they appreciate. However a start up that has say 3 people in it would be charged more because there will be more budget :)gingerbreadlady
- M_C_P0
really? people are paying for my time regardless of what i do. you want design? that's $100/hr. you want me to edit your video? that's $100/hr
you want me to water your lawn? 100/hr.hire me for my expertise and pay me for my time. you don't haggle at the doctor's office based on your condition. why haggle yourself out of being paid for your time?
- This.gramme
- One could rightly suggest that your expertise in design may be more valuable than your expertise in lawn watering.luckyorphan
- Well, of course the analogy breaks down... but I think his point is that what he does, print or web, costs the same.gramme
- As it should.gramme
- yea so he wont get the lawn gig at 100/hr. but can be rightfully compensated for what he wants to dopersona_non_grata
- scarabin0
bummer, i put my rate on an invoice recently
- That's fine if it's already been discussed, but if not, yeh, not recommended.luckyorphan
- gramme0
^ Yeah unfortunately that's a mistake I was making for a while. I have yet to find a decent client who actually cares what my hourly rate is. They just want to know how much stuff costs.
It's good to have a minimum project fee. E.g., you won't take on anything for less than $250 or $500. Keeps people from asking you to do things like turn a tiff into a jpeg.
- i_monk0
What's the best way to tell a client you're increasing your rate? Or introducing a minimum project fee ( ^ )? You know, without in effect discouraging them from calling on you?
- tell them over drinks...ideaist
- It's like a reverse raise. Establish that you've done good work over a period of time, and then hit it.luckyorphan
- i_monk0
gramme, above you say people mistake business expense for profit. I don't understand. An expense is something I pay out, not take in.
- You are not your business. Your wage is a business expense.noneck
- Think of yourself as an employee of the business you happen to own.noneck
- yep.luckyorphan
- gramme0
See what noneck said. You're in business to make a profit. Your salary is an expense paid to you by your business, even if said business is nought but yourself and four walls.
Profit is what you bank for the business AFTER setting aside operational expenses (i.e. computer, furniture, printer, travel, etc.), housing costs, utilities/monthly bills, personal savings, charitable donations, and spending money.
- scarabin0
i'm gonna be a hardass boss and pay myself nothing.
then i'll have loads of profit and be rich muah ha ha.
- gramme0
i_monk, I don't know how much this would help but you could frame it like this:
"Hopefully you [the client] can agree with me that it's in your organization's best interest that my studio [agency, firm, cult] thrives. I've recently reassessed my overhead and plans for growth. In light of that, I've decided to increase my rates in order to continue offering you the best possible service, all while ensuring the future stability of my business."
(That's what I'm gonna tell people, at any rate—haven't had to tell an existing client about this change yet. We'll see how it goes.)
- six0
i live in manchester and at the moment i'm learning new skills (web) and plan to go freelance sometime in the future. i haven't got a clue what to charge, i guess its based on experience? i'm a bit worried that if i charge too little as i'm building up my skills then ,my rates will kinda stick as i get more experienced.
where can i go for advice?
- noneck0
^ Start with the first result. http://www.google.ca/search?q=fr…
- fyoucher10
Use flat project rates but give the client a nicely designed rate card when you initially have contact with them (which either shows sample hourly rates that you use for bidding/quoting or sample project costs if you have them itemized), and give them a few sample estimates for projects that you've done in the past. This way they know what they're working with. Otherwise your high hourly rate might seem like you're charging attorney rates when in fact you charge a lot because you know your shit like the back of your hand. Like gramme said, clients only give a shit if it's within budget. Hourly rates are easier initially, but project rates save a lot of time and headaches in the end -- for you and the client.
- nb0
There was a time when I'd quote a fee for each project, but like everyone else, there are a few major problems:
• some clients want to make sure they're "getting their money's worth" and will ask for revisions or extra mockups that are a waste of everyone's time and money.
• if I underestimated a project, I would have to decide for myself if I should let the project suffer or work extra hours for free or ask my client for more money. It doesn't help me to produce mediocre work, working for free is stupid, and you never want to ask for more money. Honestly you shouldn't be ASKING for money at all, you should be telling your client what they will be paying you.
Recently, I've started to give clients an hourly rate and an estimate for each project. I let them know that I'll try to stay within the estimate and that I'll inform them if I think we'll be heading over the initial estimate. But the hourly rate is what I'm charging, and they should know that if they waste my time they are paying for it.
This has worked well lately for my clients. If someone wants a new feature or a change, I can say, "sure, that'll be a few hours work" and they know what to expect to pay. Then THEY can decide if it's worth it for them. Similar to how an autobody shop or mechanic would estimate, I think.
This new system also leaves me much happier. If I have an annoying client asking for all kinds of crazy nonsense, I just smile and remember that it's money in the bank. You want me to turn a tiff into a jpg? No problem, I'm a specialist.
As for rates? Charge high. Find out what a plumber costs in your neighbourhood and make sure you're charging more than that, perhaps double. If this seems too high, ask yourself if your talents are more uniquely valuable than a plumber. Clients generally expect to pay for things, clients who don't can go to 99designs or homestead.com and buy shit. Let them go, you don't want them as clients anyway.
- M_C_P0
some things i've heard from people smarter than I:
* start high. you can always bargain down, but never up.
* you can only charge what the market is willing to bear. obviously, if you price yourself out of the market, you'd better be a rockstar who brings the goods on time and can justify your rates.
- Meeklo0
woah... you guys must be rich
I'm at $12 an hour right now
- hektor9110
Speechless
- nocomply0
I think I've mentioned this on here before at some point, but I believe it is a good idea for freelancers in our industry to openly share their rates. Too many times we charge too little and as a result we wind up devaluing not only ourselves and our work, but also our industry peers.
So for me... I am a front-end web designer and developer and I currently charge $65/hr. I just bumped it up from $60/hr after having a lengthy conversation with my wife about my business. If I lived in LA, SF or NYC I would probably be charging more.
I think my rate is fair or perhaps a bit low, but it helps me stay in budget for my target market, which is small businesses (mom & pop type shops), restaurants, non-profits, and independent professionals like lawyers/doctors. Those people get sticker shock if I try to quote them $90/hr and at the moment I don't have the connections to get gigs that would pay me that rate.
I work out of a second bedroom in my apartment which helps to keep overhead low and helps to sustain a business at the price point that I'm in.
I work a lot like how nb outlined above. I bill everything hourly and avoid working for a flat rate whenever possible. I provide clients with an initial estimate that outlines all of my anticipated billable hours and tell them that it's an ESTIMATE, which means it's my educated guess of how long the project will take. By the time I hand over the estimate I have either met with the client in person or had a lengthy discussion over the phone and established a sense of trust. It also helps that 90% of my business comes by word of mouth so people are predisposed to trust me and think I'm generally easy to work with.
I've been doing this for about 3 years now and freelancing full-time for the past year. So far this system has worked out pretty well for me and I've avoided a lot of the headache of tedious contracts and that feeling of working a shit-ton extra for free because I booked something at a flat rate.
Of course it's not without it's drawbacks too. I never get any gigs where I absolutely make a killing of over $100/hr because I have a set hourly rate. But IMO taking advantage of gullible clients and raping them with a flat rate is not an ethical business practice that I want to engage in.
All that being said, I wind up doing a lot of work for friends, friends of friends, family, etc... and I give out discounts to those people. So getting my full rate doesn't happen all the time. Also, I have a lot of clients who I started working with years ago now and they're also paying less. I try to avoid raising my rates on existing clients, but I do so occasionally when it becomes necessary and they understand.
All and all, what I do makes an ok living for the time being, but I see a ceiling that I will hit unless I expand or change the way my business works.
Also if any other of you seasoned veterans have any advice for someone in my situation I am open to suggestions. OK that's the end of this brain dump for now.
- Great words / In the same situation myself. Trying to balance all of the mentioned...ideaist
- At the tail end of a contract position and deciding whether or not to plunge into full-time freelance with my lady...ideaist
- Funny, I've been thinking of trying to get in to the whole contract work sector. Grass is always greener I guess..nocomply
- The grass is always green. You have to sacrifice happiness/freedom for financial security it seems.ideaist
- ...I just feel like i'm meant to blaze my own trail as you have been doing... but their's a ceiling to that...ideaist
- ...like you mentioned...ideaist
- true thaticu
- it's not rape if they agree to itscarabin
- nadnerb0
80/hr