Russia-Ukraine Invasion
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- utopian2
- Foreheadshapesalad
- I'm home with the spicy cough so watched these. Interesting how the locals in Ukraine talk about the Russian soldiers destroying cultural assets/artworks.slappy
- Like ISISsted
- BuddhaHat1
- I'll never forget this guy from his scientology blow-up lol https://www.youtube.…Khurram
- NBQ00-1
The German Luftwaffe Doppeldecker jet fighters have finally arrived
- drgs0
Are we in a trap of confirmation bias?
https://www.information.dk/debat…
https://www-information-dk.trans…Russia always loses in the beginning & Russia's tactic is attrition
- rotflsted
- This was the strategy since the beginning.*sted
- There seems to be a wave of these "Russia can't be beaten" commentaries appearing...also in the New York Times.yuekit
- *whatever looks bettersted
- The question is, what does he mean by wins? How can you say Russia inevitably wins without defining it?yuekit
- If Russia's goal is to seize as much territory as possible from Ukraine then by definition the war is not pointless, because it's a fight for where thoseyuekit
- borders will be.yuekit
- Ukraine just needs to keep killing Russian solders at the current rate for Russia to exhausted its young male population by the end fo 2023.shapesalad
- The demographics of Russia suck. The motivation is dwindling. The leadership are ageing. The resources are falling.shapesalad
- Germany however.. that's a different situation. Shot themselves in the foot removing nuclear power. Their eco wind farms are redundant. Their population is old.shapesalad
- let's discuss yet another foreign country next, so we don't have to focus on our own broke governments!uan
- If figures are to be believed, Russia is losing about 150 troops per day, Ukraine about 100.Nairn
- Historian here has some blindspots - Japan, Afghanistan... the Cold War. Never mind their gains in WW1/2 were much down to UK/US industrial assistance...Nairn
- ...(ie. aid to ramp up domestic industrial capability), which they have the exact-opposite of in this conflict.Nairn
- Kinda agree with this. They did the same to Ottomans for 300 years. They are the main reason for the collapse of the empire. Attrition. They were much poorer.Beeswax
- drgs1
https://www.news.com.au/world/eu…
Russian President Vladimir Putin will land in a long-term medical facility by next year, a former MI6 chief predicted amid rumours that the Kremlin strongman’s health is failing.
Sir Richard Dearlove said on the One Decision podcast that Putin, 69, could be sent to a sanatorium as part of an exit strategy amid Russia’s struggling effort to invade neighbouring Ukraine.
- yuekit1
- ✋drgs
- genociding our kinfolk is the only wayFax_Benson
- ha, quite - 'to save the white man we must ..er.. kill the white man'.Nairn
- He does realise that in East Russia peeps look like Chinese. Russia near kazakhstan and mongolia they look arab. And ukraine look white.shapesalad
- perhaps he needs to turn his gun 180deg and head back in land to his Russia.shapesalad
- And putin looks like chinese now he's had all that botox and puffed up his checks.shapesalad
- *cheeksshapesalad
- whatever you want to tell your bigoted selfaliastime
- Reading this was brain-bending.
The cognitive dissonance is breathtaking.
And I've lost a few IQ points to reading this.Continuity - robo couldn´t have wrote it better.neverscared
- We must preserve the white Christian race...by hiring mercenary Chechen muslims to kill white Christians!!! Lolz_niko
- 卐 Hayomook Power 卍utopian
- The denazification of Ukraineyuekit
- it's suggested due to health problems, we should let pugs die out. I don't see this as being any different.imbecile
- majority of Russians are descendants of Mongol-Tatars.zaq
- Russians as in russian citizens? They are all easily separable groups
https://europepmc.or…drgs - So that's where bobo went.garbage
- haha god damn it, neverscared beat me to the punch.garbage
- yep rassa is one of the most racist countries in the world...sted
- Krassy1
Pentagon working on plans to send troops to protect US Embassy in Kyiv
- NBQ004
Wow, big if true.
Translated: Ukraine received the first American UAV MQ-9 Reaper. It is located on the territory of Ukraine: https://twitter.com/SputnikATO/s…
There were talks already weeks ago to get those over there.
- yuekit2
- the first speaker (John Mearsheimer) is a dupe of profound proportions. his understanding of the conflict is profound wrong.pr2
- second speaker (Radosław Sikorski) is all right - though probably not particularity inspiring.pr2
- 3rd guy (Stephen Walt) has no understating that ideological systems have different moral values. putting equal sign between Russia and the West is false.pr2
- 1st guys is basically lair paid by Putin (or just a obtuse idiot)pr2
- damnit...I found the first guy most convincing, even close to how I think about conflict. I'm an idiot.uan
- I probably should stop thinking life is the most valuable thing we have.uan
- short war with Russia = more wars to come = MORE lives lostpr2
- I found the Polish politician the most convincing..he's bringing the "realism" of actually living in ex Soviet country.yuekit
- so the other equation would be
long war with Russia=less wars to come=LESS live losts?uan - both 2nd and 4th guy have actually dealt with Putin and the Moscovies. The other two are just paid by Kremlin, nothing else.pr2
- Mearsheimer's view makes sense in an alternate dimension where Putin is trustworthy, has a clear set of demands and invading Ukraine addresses them somehow.yuekit
- But that is far from reality. Even people on the pro Russia side are still debating why the war happened...and Russia currently refuses to negotiate at all.yuekit
- Russia posted a clear set of demands 3 months ago: https://www.qbn.com/…
I think the negotiations stopped meanwhile.uan - So one of their demands is that Ukraine, the country being invaded, cease military action? I don't think they intended this as a serious list, ask the next dayyuekit
- and it will be Nazis or biolabs or something.yuekit
- Remember this is what Russia was saying before the invasion...yuekit
- https://www.euronews…yuekit
- They weren't saying here are our demands, give in or we invade...they just straight up lied as if they didn't care about negotiations and wanted to start a war.yuekit
- I could reply with 'what about the mil. exercises that were held before the invasion around Ukrainian borders. A show of force as a warning.'uan
- but I think it's in the nature of war propaganda to convince people they are on the right side, in both camps.uan
- sted1
- pablo28-5
- https://www.theweek.…pablo28
- this guy can fuck right offscruffics
- can this evil fucker can just shuffle off already, jfcBuddhaHat
- Khurram-4
Nuland-Pyatt Tape Removed From YouTube After 8 Years
May 25, 2022
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A popular version, with subtitles, suddenly was made unavailable on Wednesday. The tape provides the smoking gun of U.S. involvement in 2014 Kiev coup. (Read the transcript).By Joe Lauria
Special to Consortium Newshttps://consortiumnews.com/2022/…
The smoking gun proving U.S. involvement in the 2014 coup in Kiev has been removed from YouTube after eight years.
It was one of the most watched versions of the intercepted and leaked conversation between then Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland and Geoffrey Pyatt, the then U.S. ambassador to Ukraine, in which the two discuss who will make up the new government weeks before democratically-elected Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych was overthrown in a violent coup on Feb. 21, 2014.
The two talk about “midwifing” the unconstitutional change of government and “gluing it together” and of the role then Vice President Joe Biden should play and what meetings to set up with Ukrainian politicians.
The U.S. State Department never denied the authenticity of the video, and even issued an apology to the European Union after Nuland is heard on the tape saying, “Fuck the E.U.” Mainstream media at the time focused almost exclusively on that off-color remark, ignoring the greater significance of U.S. interference in Ukraine’s internal affairs.
Consortium News has numerous times embedded the YouTube video in articles about the overthrow of Yanukovych. CN successfully embedded it earlier this week in an article now being written, but on Wednesday the video suddenly appeared this way in the draft article:
- Remember this is Yanukovych, embezzled as much as $37 billion from Ukraine
https://transparency…yuekit - He fled the country (to Russia of course) and Ukraine's parliament appointed a temporary replacement until elections were held. Is that really a coup?yuekit
- Mmmm, when the American are discussing putting together a post-Yanukovych government weeks before the man has been driven out of office... kinda fishy?Khurram
- And nothing fishy about the cosy financial relationship Biden built vis-a-vis his son and the Zelensky administration, nothing fishy about these things at all!Khurram
- Yes it's all very sad but I think you might be falling for a conspiracy theory here...among other things, the clip is still on YouTube lol.yuekit
- So they literally wrote a story about ONE version of the clip being taken down, for reasons they have no idea about.yuekit
- Yeah, Matt Taibi was tweeting about it Yesterday: https://twitter.com/…Khurram
- https://twitter.com/…Khurram
- Interesting call though, a good time to highlight it.Khurram
- I don't think it shows a coup...the uprising started in 2013, this is from February 2014. It shows Americans reacting to what happened and trying to influenceyuekit
- the new government. Notice how they say we like this guy, we don't like this other guy...well how did the guy they don't like end up there if it all of this wasyuekit
- all a CIA plot or whatever people are imagining? And after this, there were two presidential elections. The "coup" narrative really makes no sense at all.yuekit
- From the video I posted above...this guy actually helped negotiate between the two sides during 2014...
https://youtu.be/Ehg…yuekit - That's a very generous narrative you're buying into there yuekit I understand why you would want to believe that.Khurram
- You're the one who is pushing a conspiracy theory here. This is how it was reported at the time:yuekit
- "Ukraine President Yanukovich impeached"
https://www.aljazeer…yuekit - https://www.kyivpost…yuekit
- That last article includes interesting detail that Yanukovych actually resigned, then tried to take it back, then he fled the country.yuekit
- You can see from these early stories that the "coup" storyline was coming from Yanukovych himself after Ukrainian parliament impeached him.yuekit
- Remember this is Yanukovych, embezzled as much as $37 billion from Ukraine
- Khurram-3
^^ Transcript of the Nuland-Pyatt call that has been wiped from YouTube:
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-e…
Ukraine crisis: Transcript of leaked Nuland-Pyatt call
Published7 February 2014Share
Victoria Nuland and Geoffrey Pyatt, Kiev, 10 December
IMAGE SOURCE,REUTERS
Image caption,Victoria Nuland and Geoffrey Pyatt together toured the opposition camp in Kiev in December
An apparently bugged phone conversation in which a senior US diplomat disparages the EU over the Ukraine crisis has been posted online. The alleged conversation between Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland and the US Ambassador to Ukraine, Geoffrey Pyatt, appeared on YouTube on Thursday. It is not clearly when the alleged conversation took place.Here is a transcript, with analysis by BBC diplomatic correspondent Jonathan Marcus:
Warning: This transcript contains swearing.
Voice thought to be Nuland's: What do you think?
Jonathan Marcus: At the outset it should be clear that this is a fragment of what may well be a larger phone conversation. But the US has not denied its veracity and has been quick to point a finger at the Russian authorities for being behind its interception and leak.
Voice thought to be Pyatt's: I think we're in play. The Klitschko [Vitaly Klitschko, one of three main opposition leaders] piece is obviously the complicated electron here. Especially the announcement of him as deputy prime minister and you've seen some of my notes on the troubles in the marriage right now so we're trying to get a read really fast on where he is on this stuff. But I think your argument to him, which you'll need to make, I think that's the next phone call you want to set up, is exactly the one you made to Yats [Arseniy Yatseniuk, another opposition leader]. And I'm glad you sort of put him on the spot on where he fits in this scenario. And I'm very glad that he said what he said in response.
Jonathan Marcus: The US says that it is working with all sides in the crisis to reach a peaceful solution, noting that "ultimately it is up to the Ukrainian people to decide their future". However this transcript suggests that the US has very clear ideas about what the outcome should be and is striving to achieve these goals. Russian spokesmen have insisted that the US is meddling in Ukraine's affairs - no more than Moscow, the cynic might say - but Washington clearly has its own game-plan. The clear purpose in leaking this conversation is to embarrass Washington and for audiences susceptible to Moscow's message to portray the US as interfering in Ukraine's domestic affairs.
Nuland: Good. I don't think Klitsch should go into the government. I don't think it's necessary, I don't think it's a good idea.Anti-government protesters in Kiev
IMAGE SOURCE,AP
Image caption,
Anti-government protesters have been camped out in Kiev since NovemberPyatt: Yeah. I guess... in terms of him not going into the government, just let him stay out and do his political homework and stuff. I'm just thinking in terms of sort of the process moving ahead we want to keep the moderate democrats together. The problem is going to be Tyahnybok [Oleh Tyahnybok, the other opposition leader] and his guys and I'm sure that's part of what [President Viktor] Yanukovych is calculating on all this.
Nuland: [Breaks in] I think Yats is the guy who's got the economic experience, the governing experience. He's the... what he needs is Klitsch and Tyahnybok on the outside. He needs to be talking to them four times a week, you know. I just think Klitsch going in... he's going to be at that level working for Yatseniuk, it's just not going to work.
Pyatt: Yeah, no, I think that's right. OK. Good. Do you want us to set up a call with him as the next step?
Nuland: My understanding from that call - but you tell me - was that the big three were going into their own meeting and that Yats was going to offer in that context a... three-plus-one conversation or three-plus-two with you. Is that not how you understood it?
Pyatt: No. I think... I mean that's what he proposed but I think, just knowing the dynamic that's been with them where Klitschko has been the top dog, he's going to take a while to show up for whatever meeting they've got and he's probably talking to his guys at this point, so I think you reaching out directly to him helps with the personality management among the three and it gives you also a chance to move fast on all this stuff and put us behind it before they all sit down and he explains why he doesn't like it.
Nuland: OK, good. I'm happy. Why don't you reach out to him and see if he wants to talk before or after.
Pyatt: OK, will do. Thanks.
Nuland: OK... one more wrinkle for you Geoff. [A click can be heard] I can't remember if I told you this, or if I only told Washington this, that when I talked to Jeff Feltman [United Nations Under-Secretary-General for Political Affairs] this morning, he had a new name for the UN guy Robert Serry did I write you that this morning?
Jonathan Marcus: An intriguing insight into the foreign policy process with work going on at a number of levels: Various officials attempting to marshal the Ukrainian opposition; efforts to get the UN to play an active role in bolstering a deal; and (as you can see below) the big guns waiting in the wings - US Vice-President Joe Biden clearly being lined up to give private words of encouragement at the appropriate moment.
Pyatt: Yeah I saw that.Nuland: OK. He's now gotten both Serry and [UN Secretary General] Ban Ki-moon to agree that Serry could come in Monday or Tuesday. So that would be great, I think, to help glue this thing and to have the UN help glue it and, you know, Fuck the EU.
Jonathan Marcus: Not for the first time in an international crisis, the US expresses frustration at the EU's efforts. Washington and Brussels have not been completely in step during the Ukraine crisis. The EU is divided and to some extent hesitant about picking a fight with Moscow. It certainly cannot win a short-term battle for Ukraine's affections with Moscow - it just does not have the cash inducements available. The EU has sought to play a longer game; banking on its attraction over time. But the US clearly is determined to take a much more activist role.
Pyatt: No, exactly. And I think we've got to do something to make it stick together because you can be pretty sure that if it does start to gain altitude, that the Russians will be working behind the scenes to try to torpedo it. And again the fact that this is out there right now, I'm still trying to figure out in my mind why Yanukovych (garbled) that. In the meantime there's a Party of Regions faction meeting going on right now and I'm sure there's a lively argument going on in that group at this point. But anyway we could land jelly side up on this one if we move fast. So let me work on Klitschko and if you can just keep... we want to try to get somebody with an international personality to come out here and help to midwife this thing. The other issue is some kind of outreach to Yanukovych but we probably regroup on that tomorrow as we see how things start to fall into place.
Nuland: So on that piece Geoff, when I wrote the note [US vice-president's national security adviser Jake] Sullivan's come back to me VFR [direct to me], saying you need [US Vice-President Joe] Biden and I said probably tomorrow for an atta-boy and to get the deets [details] to stick. So Biden's willing.
Pyatt: OK. Great. Thanks.
Jonathan Marcus: Overall this is a damaging episode between Washington and Moscow. Nobody really emerges with any credit. The US is clearly much more involved in trying to broker a deal in Ukraine than it publicly lets on. There is some embarrassment too for the Americans given the ease with which their communications were hacked. But is the interception and leaking of communications really the way Russia wants to conduct its foreign policy ? Goodness - after Wikileaks, Edward Snowden and the like could the Russian government be joining the radical apostles of open government? I doubt it. Though given some of the comments from Vladimir Putin's adviser on Ukraine Sergei Glazyev - for example his interview with the Kommersant-Ukraine newspaper the other day - you don't need your own listening station to be clear about Russia's intentions. Russia he said "must interfere in Ukraine" and the authorities there should use force against the demonstrators.
- Undoubtedly in Ukraine we have a proxy war provoked by the US to destabilize Russia, but especially the EU. With Zionist involvement, of course.pablo28
- I just don't think they should be deleting these things off YouTube. Feels like someone is trying to control the narrative of this oh holiest of holy wars.Khurram
- lol @ "with Zionist involvement". Cmon pablo you're supposed to be fighting the Nazis remember...yuekit
- Those neo-Nazis/ultranatio... are just tools used by the Zionists in the civil war that has been going on for about 8 years in Eastern Ukraine.pablo28
- ^*ultranationalistspablo28
- YouTube controlling the narrative? Big tech controlling the news? It wouldn't be the first time...Chimp
- At the end of the day would you prefer Russia & China controlling things or the USA?Chimp
- So behind the Nazis lies an international Jewish conspiracy...I gotta give you guys some credit, that is certainly original.yuekit
- Oh Pablo (aka Milan), you’re definitely a dumbass pro-Z troll.NBQ00
- drgs0
Could Russia adopt US model?
https://www.facebook.com/MBK3133…
(Khodorkovsky was Russia's wealthiest man in 2003, when Putin had him charged for fraud. He was released in 2013.)A few days ago I got to talk about the future of Russia. The topic, in my opinion, is important because before the change of this regime, there will be no reliable peace in Europe, but after it is changed - it all depends on how this change happens.
So, in my opinion, four management models with predictable development of the situation are possible:1. Putinians retain power after Putin's departure. Russia is continuing its imperial politics. Because Putin needs an external enemy to consolidate society and collect tributes from the regions at the amount of 60% of taxes and then distribute money in exchange for loyalty, the civil and imperialist wars continue. Everything is sad. The country will catch up if it does not burn in the flames of nuclear war. But when it gets enough, if it doesn't burn, it will go to one of the remaining three options.
2. The country will definitely fall apart. Its debris will create 5-7 nuclear states that will get controversial administrative boundaries and will likely fight for their expansion. War is likely to go nuclear in case of internationalization of the conflict.
3. Instead of Putins, anti-Putins will come to power, who will try to create a United Democratic Russia. Same eggs - side view.
The attempt to support the West will not be successful, as the West has lost its enthusiasm in Gorbachev's era and in exchange for support will require such geopolitical concessions that cannot be provided immediately.
And the support cannot be so large - the country is too big. The West has quite a few dangers, too.
So the process of convergence will be slow and problematic, and the power must be retained now.
And then you need an enemy. First internal and it will be - communists, patriots, security forces, rebellious or corrupt regional elites, then - external, because the fight against the internal is a fight of the democratic minority against a very different majority and will result in a to the starting point - of authoritarian coercion.4. Option four - federalization on the example of the United States. Population of regions or agglomerations of regions - I estimate 15-20 of them, become a source of power and re-establish the federal center from their representatives to solve general issues.
Perhaps, a part of this federal center will become federal parties representing those people who consider themselves first communists, liberals or patriots, and only then residents of Volga, Siberians or the Far East. I doubt that there will be more than 30% of them.It is important that all these people are not on their own, but only represent the interests of their trustees and can be recalled.
I have been a staunch supporter of the fourth model since February 24. Weimar syndrome is guaranteed to us and any model where a populist can win at the federal level, rather than a coalition of regional political entities, will undoubtedly lead to an attempted revenge. Or the detention of the unjustly conquered.Revenge or even an attempt to hold the conquered return us to the starting point - confrontations with the Western world, authoritarianism and collapse.
We, the pro-European part of Russian society and the West, will have to come to terms with the fact that Russia after Putin will remain politically and economically multifaceted: on one pole there are quite European agglomerations, on the other - "electoral sultanates" with them, in more or less, through genital-tribal relations (sometimes in the transition to feudalism).An attempt to jump over this or similar abyss in one jump was made by many, including the Bolsheviks. The relative fortunes I know are related to occupation (India) or gosterror (Stalin) are not our case.
So it is necessary to come to terms with yourself, seek consensus on common issues and hope for the strength of an example in the matter of democratization of regions. The main thing is that the parliament from the regions will not allow to spend money on foreign adventures. And not because they are particularly beautiful people there - just interests, as well as the source of legitimacy in the regions other than consolidation in the face of an external (relatively Russia) enemy.
Well, what about the risks? The risks are huge - and to fall back into authoritarianism and to collapse the country. And the price is not small - without blood, I hope it is small, it will not cost all this. However, having started an aggressive war, threatening the world with nuclear weapons one after another, Putin has made a big bet that retaliation is inevitable and we all have to pay.
- grafician1
"BIG.
Odesa military administration official says Ukraine now has a sufficient number of Harpoons from Denmark to sink all of Russian Black Sea Fleet."
- pablo28-5
Jean-Luc Godard: "Zelensky's intervention at the Cannes festival is self-evident if you look at it from the point of view of what is called "mise en scène": a bad actor, a professional comedian, under the eye of other professionals of their own professions.
I think I had to say something in this sense long ago. So it took the staging of an umpteenth world war and the threat of another catastrophe to let us know that Cannes is a propaganda tool like any other. They propagate the Western aesthetic, what...
To realize this is not much, but it is something. The truth of the images advances slowly. Now, imagine that war itself is this aesthetic deployed during a world festival, whose stakeholders are the states in conflict, or rather "in interest", broadcasting representations of which we are all spectators... you and me.
I hear people often say "conflict of interest," which is a tautology. There is no conflict, big or small, unless there is an interest. Brutus, Nero, Biden, or Putin, Constantinople, Iraq, or Ukraine, there's not much that's changed, other than the massification of murder."
- https://www.apar.tv/…pablo28
- Fuck me, you really are tedious.Continuity
- Just to be clear, his last line in this article is better translated as "not much has changed, apart from the mass murder."garbage
- Loved your old stuff J-LG, but I think you're just bitter about getting the Jury Prize in 2014.garbage
- look at it any way you want, but when you strip it all back, it is a larger country attacking a smaller one for nothing but it’s own misjudged gainscruffics
- ^ More of authoritarian making a desperate landgrab because he's dying, and he's had fetishistic ambitions about the reunification of the USSR for decades.garbage
- Lot of history behind it, but it's naive to think any of this was a surprise, or that he was going to stop in Donbas.garbage
- yuekit0
"We must say it out loud: Russia is a fascist state” says Timothy Snyder, an American historian and author of books on fascism and totalitarianism.
A time traveler from the 1930s would have no difficulty identifying the Putin regime as fascist. The symbol Z, the rallies, the propaganda, the war as a cleansing act of violence and the death pits around Ukrainian towns make it all very plain.
The war against Ukraine is not only a return to the traditional fascist battleground, but also a return to traditional fascist language and practice. Other people are there to be colonized. Russia is innocent because of its ancient past. The existence of Ukraine is an international conspiracy. War is the answer.
Because Mr. Putin speaks of fascists as the enemy, we might find it hard to grasp that he could in fact be fascist. But in Russia’s war on Ukraine, “Nazi” just means “subhuman enemy”— someone Russians can kill. Hate speech directed at Ukrainians makes it easier to murder them, as we see in Bucha, Mariupol and every part of Ukraine that has been under Russian occupation. Mass graves are not some accident of war, but an expected consequence of a fascist war of destruction.
Fascists calling other people “fascists” is fascism taken to its illogical extreme as a cult of unreason. It is a final point where hate speech inverts reality and propaganda is pure insistence. It is the apogee of will over thought. Calling others fascists while being a fascist is the essential Putinist practice. Jason Stanley, an American philosopher, calls it “undermining propaganda.”
- great citation of the 1984 apple add!uan
- "The fascist leader has to be defeated, which means that those who oppose fascism have to do what is necessary to defeat him."uan
- is he implying that the west should go to war with Russia and call them fascists? that's fascist by his own definition.uan
- He said fascism involves cult around a single leader, "cult of the dead" (Russia's worship of WW2), myth of past greatness and then turning to war toyuekit
- restore national greatness...so "make American great again" basically.yuekit
- The photos remind me of scenes from Pink Floyd's The Wall.ayport
